Jump to content


Photo

Large Peice. Support Options?


  • Please log in to reply
17 replies to this topic

#1 vrinner

vrinner

    Tourist

  • Glasser
  • Pip
  • 11 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Placentia, CA
  • Interests:Stained Glass

Posted 30 December 2016 - 01:36 PM

I'm doing a pice that has all 1 3/4 inch squares. Final size about 32"x70". Lead came except the outside will be zinc.

The piece will be mounted into a 3/4" square tube steel frame.

What concerns should I have for additional bracing and support.

Thanks!

#2 Tod Beall

Tod Beall

    Daily Mirror Owner

  • Glasser
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,632 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Massachusetts just west of Brimfield
  • Interests:Mostly flat glass. I started with sg over 30 years ago. I also collect books about sg. Please visit Beall Glass Studio on Face Book.

Posted 30 December 2016 - 04:56 PM

Is it a grid, then? Or are the square staggered - which would, I guess, leave some fractional squares....

 

Well, anyway, what sort & size of lead are you using?

 

Is the steel frame going to hold the edges like a frame? Sorry, I don't know how else to ask that, but the point is that if you have a rigid frame already the zinc is overkill & a waste of money unless you feel it makes handling the panel safer. I'm not a fan of zinc with lead - personally.



#3 vrinner

vrinner

    Tourist

  • Glasser
  • Pip
  • 11 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Placentia, CA
  • Interests:Stained Glass

Posted 31 December 2016 - 07:01 PM

It's a grid. All the same size squares.
Probably use Rh20 size came.

The steel frame will have a lip like a window.

#4 Tod Beall

Tod Beall

    Daily Mirror Owner

  • Glasser
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,632 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Massachusetts just west of Brimfield
  • Interests:Mostly flat glass. I started with sg over 30 years ago. I also collect books about sg. Please visit Beall Glass Studio on Face Book.

Posted 01 January 2017 - 11:43 AM

I'm not familiar with "Rh20" but it looks like it may be a round H-style.

The strongest leading solution for grids, square, rectangular or diamond is traditionally called "tuck & weave". It involves tucking a flat H lead into the next lead by lifting the flange. So, that option is out, but you should still do the weave.

 

It involves sort of weaving the lead so it is only two squares (or units) long. That way, the hinges are reinforced by the crossing leads. Maybe someone here has a good drawing of this pattern??

 

Still, at that height, I would certainly use some sort of horizontal reinforcing bars. These must tie into the framing somehow, whether by notching or the use of special tabs which you may need to make. It depends on the style of bar you use.

 

As you may know, the usual method of securing glass in a steel sash is the use of "spring clips". Of course, you should use steel sash putty, or make your own. Also, the steel should be well primed and painted to retard its tendency to rust.



#5 vrinner

vrinner

    Tourist

  • Glasser
  • Pip
  • 11 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Placentia, CA
  • Interests:Stained Glass

Posted 02 January 2017 - 02:42 AM

RH20 is round H-channel came.

 

Here is a picture of what it will look like. 30" X 70" and each piece of glass is 1.75" square.

 

I'm thinking three horizontal pieces of rebar then one going down the center from top to bottom.

 

Also I'm thinking by weave you mean something like the picture with the yellow lines.

 

 

Attached Files



#6 Knight

Knight

    Community Leader

  • Glasser
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 268 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Ohio, US
  • Interests:Art, nature, cooking vegetarian, listening to vinyl, and my Love.

Posted 03 January 2017 - 11:53 AM

If I made that panel in my studio it would have 2 maybe 3 vertical bars, and at least 5 horizontal bars. I use tinned steel rebar with intersections half lapped and soldered directly to the panel. I would use 3/8" rebar on the vertical and 1/4" on the horizontal. I have examples of my rebar layout and half lapped intersections in my gallery photos. 



#7 vrinner

vrinner

    Tourist

  • Glasser
  • Pip
  • 11 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Placentia, CA
  • Interests:Stained Glass

Posted 03 January 2017 - 12:55 PM

Great...thanks for all the tips and advice!



#8 vrinner

vrinner

    Tourist

  • Glasser
  • Pip
  • 11 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Placentia, CA
  • Interests:Stained Glass

Posted 05 January 2017 - 02:36 PM

So here is the piece in progress. What you see so far is about 20 X 20 inches. Overall dimensions will be about 30 X 70 inches.

Attached Files



#9 Knight

Knight

    Community Leader

  • Glasser
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 268 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Ohio, US
  • Interests:Art, nature, cooking vegetarian, listening to vinyl, and my Love.

Posted 06 January 2017 - 07:43 AM

in my opinion....and I am full of them....this won't stand a chance unless you run bars on the vertical and horizontal. Cool look, but for the size needs a skeleton for sure.



#10 vrinner

vrinner

    Tourist

  • Glasser
  • Pip
  • 11 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Placentia, CA
  • Interests:Stained Glass

Posted 06 January 2017 - 01:17 PM

in my opinion....and I am full of them....this won't stand a chance unless you run bars on the vertical and horizontal. Cool look, but for the size needs a skeleton for sure.

I do plan on putting 1/2" flat rebar on the vertical and horizontal. Probably 3 on the vertical and maybe 5 horizontal as suggested earlier.

 

The plan for assembly is;

Solder together on the front side

Then flip it

Then solder the back side

Then solder on the rebar.

 

Is that a good method?



#11 Tod Beall

Tod Beall

    Daily Mirror Owner

  • Glasser
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,632 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Massachusetts just west of Brimfield
  • Interests:Mostly flat glass. I started with sg over 30 years ago. I also collect books about sg. Please visit Beall Glass Studio on Face Book.

Posted 06 January 2017 - 01:38 PM

Will you be cementing this? If so, that comes between the soldering & the bars.



#12 vrinner

vrinner

    Tourist

  • Glasser
  • Pip
  • 11 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Placentia, CA
  • Interests:Stained Glass

Posted 07 January 2017 - 06:20 PM

Will you be cementing this? If so, that comes between the soldering & the bars.

By cementing you mean the black putty stuff and whiting? Then yes. Makes sense to do it before the bars, good tip.



#13 Knight

Knight

    Community Leader

  • Glasser
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 268 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Ohio, US
  • Interests:Art, nature, cooking vegetarian, listening to vinyl, and my Love.

Posted 09 January 2017 - 10:10 AM

Bars are the LAST thing. It will be a dynamic piece! Flipping to solder the back may be difficult, be sure to use reinforcement (a board/plywood).



#14 vrinner

vrinner

    Tourist

  • Glasser
  • Pip
  • 11 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Placentia, CA
  • Interests:Stained Glass

Posted 18 January 2017 - 12:50 PM

Here are a couple of shots of the piece coming together.

 

Question on the rebar...so should the rebar go just beyond, even with or not quite to the edges of the zinc boarder?

 

 

 

 

Attached Files



#15 Tod Beall

Tod Beall

    Daily Mirror Owner

  • Glasser
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,632 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Massachusetts just west of Brimfield
  • Interests:Mostly flat glass. I started with sg over 30 years ago. I also collect books about sg. Please visit Beall Glass Studio on Face Book.

Posted 18 January 2017 - 06:20 PM

The bars should be long enough to be secured in/by the perimeter stops.



#16 vrinner

vrinner

    Tourist

  • Glasser
  • Pip
  • 11 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Placentia, CA
  • Interests:Stained Glass

Posted 20 January 2017 - 01:00 AM

You wouldn't happen to have any pictures of what your talking about. I'm thinking parimeter stop would be the steel frame that I'm making to go around the zinc came. So that would mean that the re-bar would go all the way out to the edge of the zinc came..maybe just a tad bit more to touch the steel frame?



#17 Tod Beall

Tod Beall

    Daily Mirror Owner

  • Glasser
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,632 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Massachusetts just west of Brimfield
  • Interests:Mostly flat glass. I started with sg over 30 years ago. I also collect books about sg. Please visit Beall Glass Studio on Face Book.

Posted 20 January 2017 - 09:03 AM

Somehow, the bars must be secured into the stops holding the panel in the frame.

Typically, a flat bar would be inserted into a slot in the removable stop. This hold the bar up and in.

I have no pics but I'll look around this weekend. Maybe someone else has one?



#18 vrinner

vrinner

    Tourist

  • Glasser
  • Pip
  • 11 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Placentia, CA
  • Interests:Stained Glass

Posted 31 January 2017 - 07:54 PM

Here is an update on the piece. Have it all soldered together, rebar on the back side of this picture...sorry...didn't get a picture of it.

 

Next is to build the steel frame, put piece in frame and use tabs at each of the 2 horizontal rebars to help support. This piece will actually be hanging in a portrait orientation.

 

20170129_175902_1.jpg






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users